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> Camera movment
Sain
post Oct 23 2007, 06:29 AM
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Umm... Dunno if this is in the right forums,
One thing I dont like about most mmos these days is the view of your character(the camera),
every time you turn your character
you have to (hold the leftclick and move the camera to the same direction.
I was thinking like it could have like smart movment or something so every time you move your char. the cam auto moves to the same direction .
(i hope every gets what im trying to say :s) i had a hard time trying to think of how to say it.
Sorry for any bad spelling:(
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Jerky
post Oct 23 2007, 11:07 AM
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That okay, I moved it for you.

It is definitely something to think about. Little things like that, which are usually a minor part of the design, can cause grief to anyone's experience in the game.

Thanks for the suggestion. Do you have any examples of games that did the camera the way you like?


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Minthos
post Oct 23 2007, 03:32 PM
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At least in WoW, when you turn the camera, the character follows (depending on which mouse button you use to turn the camera). Many games (not just mmos) have a 'chase cam' kinda thing, where the camera looks where the character turns, but only after a slight delay (presumably to appear 'smooth', nothing could be more annoying).
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Hankellin
post Oct 24 2007, 03:15 AM
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I would like th ability to have a "chase camera" or the Isometric View(God View: Looking down from about a 30degree angle) either selectable. Or even the set the camera to a view and it stays at that view.


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RicoSuave
post Oct 24 2007, 11:16 AM
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I agree with Minthos in the fact that the 'smooth' camera chase (Neverwinter Nights) was painful most of the time. I'm a bit weird on this, but I don't care if the camera never moves at all as long as I can zoom out as far as I need to. For me, intel-gathering is more than just necessary. It is completely integral to every single decision I make (gaming or real-world).

Perhaps, we can make a smooth chase just an option to check if you are into self-torture. But I would greatly appreciate it if we could have a myriad of ways to "View the World" (i.e. 1st-person, instant-chase, smooth-chase, fixed, auto-danger-facing, auto-action-facing, user-controlled, locked-angle-on-character, et al).

At times, each one of these comes in handy... except that annoying smooth-scrolling chase camera! *Yuck!*
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Sain
post Oct 24 2007, 01:49 PM
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Umm...
Yes Wow it has that feature you can turn it off in the options and set the delay of the movement.
BTW I'M EX-WOW !!!!! quit along time ago..
lol i had to say that
I hate that game! wink.gif tongue.gif
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RicoSuave
post Oct 25 2007, 12:10 PM
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Sain, you'll notice here that the community tends to shy-away from generally speaking that a game (as a whole) is good or poor. We try hard to look for what certain game did well in our opinion, and what we can improve upon.

Like you, I used to play WoW and have since quit. And I try to look at what very talented programmers and designers did well. If you do want to express opinion about games and your dislike for them, please do. However, realize that we can only improve if specifics are mentioned (i.e. "I hate WoW because as you enter a new area of the map, there is no transition. The screen just fades into the new landscape rapidly"). Thus we are able to address very specific points and improve upon them. smile.gif

By the way, what type of camera view do you like the best?
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Brotoi
post Dec 2 2007, 07:45 PM
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Although there are some differences between then, both Lineage II and City of Heroes have nice camera movement. There is an "auto-follow" option in Lineage II that drives me up the wall, but once I turn it off the camera behaves exactly how I expect it to.

Bascially, I keep my camera far enough behind the character to see their feet and a small open space between their feet and the frame. I manually vary the angle according to the terrain, because I have yet to find a camera AI that thinks even remotely like I do, but normally I keep a pretty low angle with long front view and reasonable side view. I use movement keys to spin the character when I want to change the front view.

Simple, while still allowing the user the choice to make things complex, is usually the best design paradigm in any situation.
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Jerky
post Dec 3 2007, 12:36 AM
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QUOTE(Brotoi @ Dec 2 2007, 06:45 PM) *

Simple, while still allowing the user the choice to make things complex, is usually the best design paradigm in any situation.

Indeed. Choice is the key thing I have focused on in all of my ideas. With the different combat ideas we are looking into, we may possibly have a new interface not many people will have seen before. Think of a top-down view of the battle in a mini-window that should keep you apprised of angle of attack, etc.


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RicoSuave
post Dec 3 2007, 02:06 PM
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QUOTE(Jerky @ Dec 3 2007, 01:36 AM) *
...Think of a top-down view of the battle in a mini-window that should keep you apprised of angle of attack, etc.
Speaking of keeping us apprised... isn't it about that time again? wink.gif

I excited to see a quick preview of the concept art.
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Brotoi
post Dec 3 2007, 03:16 PM
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QUOTE(Jerky @ Dec 3 2007, 03:36 PM) *

Indeed. Choice is the key thing I have focused on in all of my ideas. With the different combat ideas we are looking into, we may possibly have a new interface not many people will have seen before. Think of a top-down view of the battle in a mini-window that should keep you apprised of angle of attack, etc.


That's an interesting idea... Have you played Guild Wars? One of the things I liked about Guild Wars was the enemy dots in the mini-map/radar. Granted, in real life ambushes followed by hit and run are the key to individual and small group combat, that does not change the simple reality that getting ambushed by NPCs too high for you to handle does not make an enjoyable game experience.
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Areena
post Jan 18 2008, 10:47 AM
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IMO DAoC had an awesome camera system. The default camera was a chase camera, but it didn't have the delay or whatever, i mean you could give yourself a seizure if you could spam turn left/right fast enough.

The best part was that one of the function keys toggled between the default view and a first person view(very handy in dungeons when you're up against the wall) and the third option would just dump the camera where it was as you ran away(very handy for keeping an eye on chokepoints in PvP if you were AF'ing someone)

edit: I'm the anti-fan of a radar map that shows where enemies/friendlies are. Minimap in the corner, awesome everytime. Radar that shows me the path I need to take to not get swamped with mobs, though useful, I still hate it, it takes the element of 'oh shizz I hope I can make it through here and if not hopefully i release/res close to where I'm trying to get.

This post has been edited by Areena: Jan 18 2008, 10:50 AM


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Jerky
post Jan 18 2008, 12:02 PM
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I know I've mentioned (and posted) this in another thread before, but this is sorta how I imagine it working. The first radar would be "perfect" sight, hearing and smell, which would be skills.
Attached Image
This second would illustrate how it would work if someone had less-than-perfect sight. Imagine both the hearing and smell would also be effected by lower skills.
Attached Image

I know these are flawed, but they get the idea across. I would think that your camera would also track your head movement. Meaning, as you rotated the camera around and are looking around, your character would also be looking around, which would cause the radar to rotate.


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Areena
post Jan 18 2008, 12:08 PM
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rather than having smell just be a small circle around you what about having it be more like a narrower version of sight in the direction the wind is coming from. I don't know if wind is indeed going to be implemented or not, but it would add the element of a big stinky troll being able to sneak up on you if he came from downwind of you.


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Jerky
post Jan 18 2008, 03:35 PM
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Sure, as I said, it was a quick mock up meant to convey the idea, it wasn't meant as the solution. I am sure we could get very detailed if we wanted to be.

It is good to think about these things though. Smell and Hearing would be the only things that would allow you to know what is behind you. Adding wind/environment into the equations could get complicated. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't try wink.gif.


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