Specific IDEAS from wish that we'd like to see implemented Options

[bezerker]

with given percentage, the less experienced player won't feel the pinch so bad.

with a player that has been amassing a substancial amount of gold, a single death could cost him hundreds even thousands in gold debts.

I like the idea of having to 'bind' at a temple or priest. I was never big on the idea of spawning back at some mysterious object or portal that has no real in-game explanation. These temples would not necessarily have to be in towns but towns would probably the most common location.


given that we do have necromancy and healers and sorcerors in this game, the temple should be the ideal place to resurrect the player after dying, thus making it more believable.

In some races, dying in combat results in the player being bound to servitude to the resurrector for an X amount of time perhaps? The Cyclops or Dragonkin races are more or less spiritual beings and dying may or may not cause them to be indebted to the person that resurrected them.

just my two cents,

[sblmnl]

If it was a really large amount, or even a % of the player's net worth, it could make a great gold-sink for advanced players.

Building on that - as your debt is really to the community that "maintains" the temple, and to avoid saddling new players with gold-debt, make it that you can alternatively choose to perform a community service. And until you've cleared all your debts, you are not allowed to change your city allegiance, hire npcs etc.

Functionally this could operate as a special type of quest:

Perhaps the mayor or temple-leader-npc could tell you a list of what needs to be done, and you can choose according to your capability. Each task would expunge a certain amount of debt (the calculation should not be expressed numerically though, the npc should say only, when a certain task is selected, that your rights as a citizen of (town) would be fully restored (or not). The tasks should not be overly onerous, for example it could range from contributing a small amount of resources, which would expunge say 1-5 deaths, or taking a "young" (ie, with skills less than specified level) player as a apprentice/squire for say 4 hours in-game time, worth say 5-10 deaths - during which time his/her overall skills would have to increase by n. percent. Or powerful pvm/pvp characters might choose to perform one very difficult service to expunge a lot of deaths - like hunting down a very dangerous creature, or a dangerous npc or a specific player murderer! - or if your town is at war, personally defeating n. enemies. There are lots of possibilities.

Let's keep the sense of risk and danger in Wish. I think it was one of the things which made it so addictive. I think Wish's pvp setup was "area only" or 100% consensual/guild war based? After a lot of thought, I'd like to keep a modified, less restrictive form of pvp than that. The exception should be young players below a certain skill level in guarded areas, and the newly resurrected, who shouldn't be attackable or able to attack other players at all for a grace period, to avoid res killing /griefing.

With those exceptions, I think that technically pvp should be enabled everywhere - but there are severe consequences if you attack another player in civilised (guard-protected)
areas. I've posted about it at the end of this thread http://www.projectwish.com/viewtopic.php?p...highlight=#1389 so I won't do it again here :-), please have a look though.

Another "keeper" from Wish I forgot to mention in there is that players should keep their items when they die. Period. No-looting rules may not be "realistic" but then, neither is resurrection. Opportunities for players to enrich themselves at the expense of other players should be severely restricted - although we should have theives and of course, the odd unscrupulous trader is a given ;-).

And please let us never ever, EVER have a "kill score" published anywhere, or any other encouragement for noto-killers. I liked the idea I heard Wish would have, of players earning titles - as murderers essentially chose become outcasts, instead they should lose their titles.

Hmm.. and I think, at least in the beginning, we should keep Wish's no player-owned housing. In Wish that there were a lot of empty buildings standing around - so instead of introducing custom housing, let guild leaders rent these from the town, and hire npcs to place there as needed, including a banker who could hold guild resources accessible to members who pay their tithe or whatever. Maybe a limited amout of player-crafted furniture could be placed in such buildings, while the lease is paid up.

(EDIT: forgot this) Finally, let's keep realistic-looking models. Perhaps it's just me but I have a BIG problem relating to "cartoony" looking avatars, for example WoW or UXO.

And do we want to keep one character per account? I know I'd *really* want two, but I think if we are trying to create a game where your character's choices really matter, then probably your choices about your character should matter too.

[khrag]

Well I think everything from Wish should be in, except.

When you die, your pet should be transported with you. (that was the worst spending 240 on a dog and dieing and him going wild before you get back to him)

Beginner items should cost much less (or when apprenticing, give free crap tools)

NPC vendors should sell nothing but PC created stuff and newbie equipment. (although I think there should be a Dev controlled economy system. Say Dev's can set the price of what the vendors will pay for something, and what they will sell it for.) We all remember what a pain in the ass it was to buy ore for 8gpu and to have to sell your creations at a huge price or at a loss.

Just my few ideas

[Jerky]

I disagree with the cheap newbie tools thing. That discourages players from learning every profession from the start. I thought it was great. Yeah, I wanted to do every profession when I was playing too, but not being able to forced me to stick to one, which was the best thing, because I was able to get to the point of making money much faster. I thought that the skills thing is one thingtha we should try to get correct, and as Wish was pretty dang close to perfect (IMO) in this area (for those skills that were implemented). As someone says: "Don't mess with success." I think that there is still a lot of skills and things to add to what Wish had, but those are just my 2 cents.

[ysu]

This is all nice, but Melante, could you please update the first topic to reflect all the ideas? that way new visitors don't have to comb through all the posts...

[bezerker]

thread also has some pretty good ideas to combine with this thread of posts. an update on our current idea should be nice. Forum mods, can we get a stickie on this?

[HeavensLastHope]

About the Caravan Idea/Concept, there should be like 4 different levels of Caravans

Example:



*Can hold up to 4 players (not including NPCs)
*Requires 2 pony/horses to pull
*has 1,000 pound capacity for storing stuff
*Low Armor Rating (depending on what the caravan is made of)
*No Defencive Weapons (players in caravan would have to defend if the caravan is attacked)



*Can hold up to 8 players
*Requires 3 pony/horses to pull
*has 1,750 pound capacity for storing stuff
*Medium Armor Rating (depending on what the caravan is made of)
*Low Level Defencive Weapons "2 defencive mounts" (players can either mount on the caravan's weapons or leave the caravan to fight of enemys)

High-Class Caravan:

*Can hold up to 14 players
*Requires 5 pony/horses to pull
*has 3,000 pound capacity for storing stuff
*High Armor Rating (depending on what the caravan is made of)
*Medium Level Defencive Weapons "3 defencive mounts"



*Can hold up to 22 players
*Requires 8 pony/horses to pull
*has 4,500 pound capacity for storing stuff
*High Armor Rating + Metal Plating Armor (depending on what caravan is made of & depending on what metal is used for Metal Plating)
*High Level Defencive Weapons "5 defencive mounts"

------------------------------

Ok now thats my idea.

plus it would be nice if the players could make them and drive them.

Or

Towns that wanna make a caravan, would have to ask the mayor and players would have to get the amount needed to make a curtain caravan.

[Melanthe]

About the Caravan Idea/Concept, there should be like 4 different levels of Caravans

...Towns that wanna make a caravan, would have to ask the mayor and players would have to get the amount needed to make a curtain caravan.

Great ideas about the caravans. Only I'd hate for it to become something only towns could do, if it turned out only a town could get enough resources together for a really strong one, and people wouldn't use weaker ones, which seems possible. To me, that would put too much power in the hands of one player (the mayor).

I'd personally prefer that any player or group of players could gather resources and provide the service, selling tickets at a depot or caravanserai in each major town, perhaps.

The ticketing process could be something similar to the Wish auction, buyer talks to an innkeeper or reads a board or such and gets a list of departures/times/price etc. Of course weaker caravans would cost less, etc. It would be a great way to meet other PC's too, by traveling with them, and perhaps sharing in defending against bandits, etc. :)

This would also help solve a problem some of the warrior-types were complaining about with Wish--the lack of something for them to do. Defending caravans and/or attacking them could be a great role for the pure warrior.

[bezerker]

will definately give reason for thieves to band together to grab the loot. thumbs up for the caravan idea!

[Pashta]

Criaus, could you pretty please format your response into paragraphs? I just cannot read what you wrote the way it is, it really hurts my eyes...

[Jerky]

Holy smokes! I would not want to be a coder right now. These ideas are incredibly cool, but also incredibly complex. These ideas are making this into SimFantasy. A fastasy game and a sim game mixed. So many different variables. Yeesh. Once again. Keep the ideas coming, but don't expect them all to actually make it into the game.

[Melanthe]

Which parts are you saying would be particularly difficult, Jerky?

I can see both code and social complexities and challenges to the caravan idea, but on the other hand, they may be worth it.

[HeavensLastHope]

Mobs should seem intellegent, so they should like be able to determend if its worth attacking a caravan, the following would be what the AI for the mob would do to determend to attack or not to attack:

*Mobs own lvl
*Number of Mobs in the group
*The Defence Level of the Caravan
*Number of players in the Caravan (if any)
*What type of loot the caravan is holding (including the stuff the players are holding that could be concidered "loot")
*Plus the chances of succesfully attacking and killing everything on the caravan

So all this to would be added up & determind if the mob(s) would attack the caravan. its seems simple enough to me.

but the major part of mobs attacking a caravan is to abtain its loot & riches. so if it be a very low lvl caravan, then less chances of it being attacked, but higher the lvl of the caravan, more chances. but thats all depends on what type of mobs they are and the area your in.

[Melanthe]

Mobs should seem intellegent, so they should like be able to determend if its worth attacking a caravan, the following would be what the AI for the mob would do to determend to attack or not to attack:

*Mobs own lvl
*Number of Mobs in the group
*The Defence Level of the Caravan
*Number of players in the Caravan (if any)
*What type of loot the caravan is holding (including the stuff the players are holding that could be concidered "loot")
*Plus the chances of succesfully attacking and killing everything on the caravan

So all this to would be added up & determind if the mob(s) would attack the caravan. its seems simple enough to me.

but the major part of mobs attacking a caravan is to abtain its loot & riches. so if it be a very low lvl caravan, then less chances of it being attacked, but higher the lvl of the caravan, more chances. but thats all depends on what type of mobs they are and the area your in.

Those are some excellent points, HLH.

[Vamyen]

Ideas added for consideration.

My head hurts after this.

[Minthos]

My head hurts after this.

Dark magic has a tendency to do that..

[Pandra]

>.> I orgianlly stopped reading after the first page. But I think it should be noted for future instances, any time a none coder says "It seems simple to me" tell them great! So you can figure out a math equation to represent the senario(s).

I'm not a coder, but I know it's difficult math, i.e. not simple for the average bear. Assuming a problem will be simple for someone else to solve is arrogent and shows poor judegment.

[RicoSuave]

I am a coder, and I know it's difficult math.

[Brotoi]

There are four things from Wish that I "wish" every game would implement:

Open skill system with automatic skill advancement according to ingame activity and NO character levels
Automatic assignment to a hometown guild
Multiple guild membership possible (personal, hometown, occupation)
Mulitple global chat channels (hometown, region, race) and infinite ability to add more

The Wish chat client was hands down one of the most user friendly I have ever encountered

The one thing I did not like about the Wish skill system was being forced to choose two skill trees with little or no ability to advance other skills. I spent a LOT of time exploring, mostly because the first day I died outside my hometown and wound up halfway across the world! The journey back ignited the exploration bug in me big time. There was huge variety in the Wish map even over short distances with very natural placement of environments, micro-environments, and so on. Someone did a lot of botanic and geologic research before creating that map.

However, my character was forced to specialize in only two skills (I choose lumberjacking for the secondary strength improvement and magic for the combat skills and secondary discovery improvements) which meant my rapidly advancing discovery skill often revealed metals, usuable plants, harvestable foodstuffs, and dozens of other things that I never had the appropriate skill level to exploit. I don't know how many times I sent up a shout in one of my guild channels about a discovery only to learn that no one had a skill which could take advantage of it.

This post has been edited by Brotoi: Dec 2 2007, 08:46 PM

[Jerky]

We definitely have pinpointed those same things regarding Wish. I am glad you reiterated them in a concise manner. I can say that we will have things very similarly to those you described Wish having (guilds, chat, interface, open skill system).

Moreover, since I started designing the skill system (its not done yet) those same concerns have come up. I definitely have a few ideas on how to avoid pigeon-holing players into "classes." If you are interested in some reading, I've got a lot on the subject of skill v. class.